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Springs Over or Under????

Discussion in 'Wrangler YJ (1986-1995)' started by HotRodN, Dec 28, 2016.

  1. Dec 28, 2016 at 2:58 PM
    #1
    HotRodN

    HotRodN [OP] Active Member

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    Greg
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    Bumper, winch, fender flares. Stock ride height for now.
    Been looking at several other YJ's and have another question. How difficult is it to put the springs on top of the axles and what issues could it cause. The ones on there now give it at least a 4 inch lift. Where would I get a set of leaf springs to run them on the tip of the axle? I think it would equal to almost the same lift. Will doing them over the top make for a better ride or is below the preferred method.
    Thanks again,
    HotRodN
     
  2. Dec 29, 2016 at 6:06 PM
    #2
    OFFGRID

    OFFGRID Well-Known Member

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    Howell fuel injection, header, HEI distributor, TH350, NP208, SOA lift with YJ springs in the front & GW springs in the Rear. AMC20 with G2 1 piece chromos trussed, Dana 30 with G2 chromos and 760x ujoints and MM Stainless Hubs, Geared 4.56. Tom Woods shafts, Metal cloaks, Caged, 37" Toyo MTs.
    Check out http://www.rocky-road.com/index2.html They have an excellent spring over lift. Issues: poor instructions, Custom spring packs will need to be made for the back and move the back springs to the front for added strength to prevent axle wrap. Here is that article http://www.fourwheeler.com/how-to/16719/ You will get approx 6.5in of lift. Here is a pick of my CJ7 with a YJ spring conversion and a Rock-road SOA lift with 37s. I can fit 40s easy enough, but will get into my fenders on the trails.

    20160409_114453.jpg
     
  3. Dec 29, 2016 at 6:29 PM
    #3
    C2T

    C2T Well-Known Member

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    Richard
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    2.5" AEV Dual Sport lift, 35" Treadwright Guard Dogs, Black Rock Wheels, AEV Front & Rear Bumpers with Tire Carrier, Fuel Caddy 10 gal. Aux. fuel tank, Warn 9.5ti, 125' synthetic winch line, front axle skid, 20" LED light bar , Bilstein Shocks, steel steering skidplate,
    == looks good!
     
  4. Dec 29, 2016 at 6:42 PM
    #4
    OFFGRID

    OFFGRID Well-Known Member

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    Houston
    Vehicle:
    1979 Jeep CJ7, 258, TH350, NP208
    Howell fuel injection, header, HEI distributor, TH350, NP208, SOA lift with YJ springs in the front & GW springs in the Rear. AMC20 with G2 1 piece chromos trussed, Dana 30 with G2 chromos and 760x ujoints and MM Stainless Hubs, Geared 4.56. Tom Woods shafts, Metal cloaks, Caged, 37" Toyo MTs.
    An answer to the ride question. When going spring over, it allows you to run your factory springs which are much softer riding than the super arching lifted springs, but I have heard that some springs like the Rubicon 4.5in lift springs ride very well. The Rubicon 4.5 in lift is in my opinion easier to install (less parts), but Rocky-road's SOA lift is well made and a fairly easy bolt on kit. If you decide to go with their "High steer" over their generic drag link, be prepared to spend at least a day with a file to make it fit. I ended up purchasing a Hitachi electric file/grinder just for installing the High steer.
     
  5. Dec 30, 2016 at 6:45 AM
    #5
    HotRodN

    HotRodN [OP] Active Member

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    Bumper, winch, fender flares. Stock ride height for now.
    Offgrid,,,, that is an awesome looking ride ya got there,,,, thank you for the links,,, I see your close to me,,, would like to see that ride in person,,,, I don't have the original springs,,, I bought it already lifted with the high arch springs. I'll keep those for now until axle selection is done,,,, I may do that older Chevy setup thing you mentioned,,,, time to get online and search for what's out there :) Later
    HotRodN
     
  6. Dec 30, 2016 at 2:03 PM
    #6
    OFFGRID

    OFFGRID Well-Known Member

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    Vehicle:
    1979 Jeep CJ7, 258, TH350, NP208
    Howell fuel injection, header, HEI distributor, TH350, NP208, SOA lift with YJ springs in the front & GW springs in the Rear. AMC20 with G2 1 piece chromos trussed, Dana 30 with G2 chromos and 760x ujoints and MM Stainless Hubs, Geared 4.56. Tom Woods shafts, Metal cloaks, Caged, 37" Toyo MTs.
    Sounds great Greg. Where are you located, and THANK YOU FOR YOUR SERVICE! If you search for groups Texas Jeep Swap Shop, Texas Jeep Parts For Sale, and General Sam's Offroad Park in Facebook, You will find tons of parts for offroading at most of the time reasonable to great prices.
     
  7. Jan 1, 2017 at 5:07 PM
    #7
    HotRodN

    HotRodN [OP] Active Member

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    Bumper, winch, fender flares. Stock ride height for now.
    I live in Cypress close to 249 and North Pointe. Got to go play with the Jeep a little this weekend and yep,,,, got it stuck a few times. So glad it has a wench up front LOL. The kids were a big help too. They would come check on me and help get it out when stuck up to the axles in the mud. Need tires made for the mud :) Had a blast LOL.
     
  8. Jan 1, 2017 at 5:56 PM
    #8
    OFFGRID

    OFFGRID Well-Known Member

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    1979 Jeep CJ7, 258, TH350, NP208
    Howell fuel injection, header, HEI distributor, TH350, NP208, SOA lift with YJ springs in the front & GW springs in the Rear. AMC20 with G2 1 piece chromos trussed, Dana 30 with G2 chromos and 760x ujoints and MM Stainless Hubs, Geared 4.56. Tom Woods shafts, Metal cloaks, Caged, 37" Toyo MTs.
    Where did you take it wheeling? I usually go to General Sam's in Huntsville. I have been to Creekside once, it wasn't bad. I really dislike the mud, but my boy loves it. If I don't hit mud in the first half hour he's like, "Daddy lets go home".
     
  9. Jan 1, 2017 at 6:50 PM
    #9
    HotRodN

    HotRodN [OP] Active Member

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    Greg
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    Bumper, winch, fender flares. Stock ride height for now.
    Yea the kids don't get the concept of how much work it is to clean them up after getting in the mud LOL. It ook me a good two hours today to get most but not all of the stuck on mud off the thing. Glad it's just a trial ride for now.
    My girl friend and her son have a really big back yard,,, like 100 acres I think,,,, there is a creek that runs through it but unless it's rained a lot it's not very deep. Maybe a foot or so. Once past that the trail kinda stays muddy. When it's raining like it has been there are quite a few places that rut up and make it fun to drive around in. Turns are tight between trees but the Jeep gets through them all okay. If your going very fast ya just might hit a tree if your not on the ball. It's all heavy woods dude. We've cut quite a few trails around the place and I'm hoping to make a few more. Haven't learned the whole lay out and was a bit lost last night. The kids know it all very well and got me back to the front. They tear it up on the ATV's LOL.
    I think it's time to get a rear wench on this thing too. Just in case I get where it won't back up. Almost had that happen to me last night.
     
  10. Jan 2, 2017 at 8:19 PM
    #10
    OFFGRID

    OFFGRID Well-Known Member

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    1979 Jeep CJ7, 258, TH350, NP208
    Howell fuel injection, header, HEI distributor, TH350, NP208, SOA lift with YJ springs in the front & GW springs in the Rear. AMC20 with G2 1 piece chromos trussed, Dana 30 with G2 chromos and 760x ujoints and MM Stainless Hubs, Geared 4.56. Tom Woods shafts, Metal cloaks, Caged, 37" Toyo MTs.
    Not sure if your interested but I bought a T-case from a guy in Montgomery. He is turning an 82 Chevy heavy halfton farm truck into a mud truck. It has low miles. He will probably sell the axles front Dana 44 and rear GM 12 bolt (maybe a 14 bolt) for $600-800. let me know if you're interested.
     
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2017
  11. Jan 3, 2017 at 5:09 PM
    #11
    HotRodN

    HotRodN [OP] Active Member

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    Bumper, winch, fender flares. Stock ride height for now.
    Yea I would be interested in the axles,,,, at least they should already match in width and gearing I'd suppose. Do you know if the front axle is a driver side drop???
     
  12. Jan 4, 2017 at 1:14 PM
    #12
    OFFGRID

    OFFGRID Well-Known Member

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    1979 Jeep CJ7, 258, TH350, NP208
    Howell fuel injection, header, HEI distributor, TH350, NP208, SOA lift with YJ springs in the front & GW springs in the Rear. AMC20 with G2 1 piece chromos trussed, Dana 30 with G2 chromos and 760x ujoints and MM Stainless Hubs, Geared 4.56. Tom Woods shafts, Metal cloaks, Caged, 37" Toyo MTs.
    Not sure, I believe it is a Driver side drop. Good time t switch to Dana 300 passenger side. I have one that I'm not going to use that I will sell for $100 (what I paid for it). I don't know the condition. The guy I bought it from bought several from a shop that was closing. It does come with a Twin stick that needs to be installed. I planned on rebuilding it. The guy with the axles number is(936)524-9469 and his name is Kevin.
     
  13. Jan 4, 2017 at 1:17 PM
    #13
    OFFGRID

    OFFGRID Well-Known Member

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    Vehicle:
    1979 Jeep CJ7, 258, TH350, NP208
    Howell fuel injection, header, HEI distributor, TH350, NP208, SOA lift with YJ springs in the front & GW springs in the Rear. AMC20 with G2 1 piece chromos trussed, Dana 30 with G2 chromos and 760x ujoints and MM Stainless Hubs, Geared 4.56. Tom Woods shafts, Metal cloaks, Caged, 37" Toyo MTs.
    The axles I believe are 5-7in wider than YJ axles, but the spring perches match up in the front. I'm not sure about the back, but it is easy enough to move the rear perches. Most of the older half ton Chevys ran 373 or 410 gears. A few ran 355.
     
  14. Jan 4, 2017 at 5:30 PM
    #14
    HotRodN

    HotRodN [OP] Active Member

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    Bumper, winch, fender flares. Stock ride height for now.
    Wow that does make for a wide stance LOL,,, it could be made a little less with wheel back spacing. I like the wider stance especially with it being lifted. Makes the roll over angle a tad greater than stock axles.
    If I do get the axles and the front is a driver drop,,, how would it get converted to a passenger drop? I'm assuming flipping it over which would also make it a high pinion right?
    I've also found an older truck that could be had and it would give me the whole setup to pull from. I'm just not big on having to dispose of the remaining vehicle. It doesn't have a title so you couldn't sell it for scrap metal. Plus there's just all that time and hassle. Time is not on my side with the hours I work and a GF that wants what I do have. At least she likes hot rods and playing in the back 40 :) I'll give Kevin a call and see where things go. Hope to pick up the 383 and trans this weekend first.
     
  15. Jan 4, 2017 at 7:12 PM
    #15
    OFFGRID

    OFFGRID Well-Known Member

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    1979 Jeep CJ7, 258, TH350, NP208
    Howell fuel injection, header, HEI distributor, TH350, NP208, SOA lift with YJ springs in the front & GW springs in the Rear. AMC20 with G2 1 piece chromos trussed, Dana 30 with G2 chromos and 760x ujoints and MM Stainless Hubs, Geared 4.56. Tom Woods shafts, Metal cloaks, Caged, 37" Toyo MTs.
    You can't flip and call it high pinion. Doesn't work like that. You have to get an appropriate Tcase hence my reference to the Dana 300 Tcase .
     
  16. Jan 4, 2017 at 7:53 PM
    #16
    OFFGRID

    OFFGRID Well-Known Member

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    1979 Jeep CJ7, 258, TH350, NP208
    Howell fuel injection, header, HEI distributor, TH350, NP208, SOA lift with YJ springs in the front & GW springs in the Rear. AMC20 with G2 1 piece chromos trussed, Dana 30 with G2 chromos and 760x ujoints and MM Stainless Hubs, Geared 4.56. Tom Woods shafts, Metal cloaks, Caged, 37" Toyo MTs.
    Really if you have a bead on a whole truck, that's the way to go. Adapters and accessories to make everything mesh gets expensive. I just spent 500 on a th350 and np208. To make it all work, motor to tran adapter, tran cooler and lines, Trans cable shifter, Tcase cable shifter, SYE kit, drive shafts, torque converter and probable stuff I'll still need to get I'm at an additional $2200, but I have my T150 and Dana 20(twin stick,teralow) sold for $500.
     
  17. Jan 5, 2017 at 5:57 AM
    #17
    JeepAndrew

    JeepAndrew Active Member

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    I have a spring-over '93. Rear was pretty much cut-and-dry; super easy. Weld on perches and that was basically it. Front was more involved. Did a heavy duty high-steer setup and re-worked my spring mounts. Ended up doing a shackle reversal while I was at it. I'm running custom made 2.5" springs right now with 1.5 inch shackles, so around 9" of lift with the spring-over. Rides like a dream and has insane flex for a leaf-sprung Jeep.
     
    OFFGRID likes this.
  18. Jan 5, 2017 at 5:39 PM
    #18
    HotRodN

    HotRodN [OP] Active Member

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    Bumper, winch, fender flares. Stock ride height for now.
    Hey guy's,,, the truck is a 78 (I think) 4x4 but has no title. I'm not sure if the axle width would be too great for this thing,,,, I'd have to get some good numbers from what I have now and compare to what the truck axles are. Still doing a lot of research and getting ya'lls great input. I would really prefer to get it all from one donor vehicle instead of piece milling it. Just seems like the easiest way to go. If I knew exactly what worked with what that would make it easier also.

    I'm not fixed on the spring over but warming up to it. Just seems like it would be a bit stronger (with the shorter moments) and way less rock and roll from the really long spring under setups with long shackles.

    Is there a book that covers all the different models with good specification detail that can be had?
    At least I'm having blast learning it all. It'll be a decent ride once done.
     
  19. Jan 5, 2017 at 7:04 PM
    #19
    OFFGRID

    OFFGRID Well-Known Member

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    1979 Jeep CJ7, 258, TH350, NP208
    Howell fuel injection, header, HEI distributor, TH350, NP208, SOA lift with YJ springs in the front & GW springs in the Rear. AMC20 with G2 1 piece chromos trussed, Dana 30 with G2 chromos and 760x ujoints and MM Stainless Hubs, Geared 4.56. Tom Woods shafts, Metal cloaks, Caged, 37" Toyo MTs.
    For the most part all truck axles are spring over except for Jeep brand vehicles. . It is not like trying to SOA your jeep axles. When you swap in truck axles the work is already done for you except that you may have to move the spring perches in the back. YJ axles are 60in. Wide where as the JK axles are 65in wide, and the Chevy truck axles I believe are 67in wide (going from memory might be off an inch here or there). After market flares will cover your tires.

    I've always built trucks and never thought about under/over, axle widthe etc until I started building my CJ almost 3 years ago. I have learned a lot and wasted a ton of money because I did things without researching, and assuming. There are so many combos out there that I want to try that I'm ready to finish this CJ and start on my next 2. This gets addicting quick!
     
  20. Jan 7, 2017 at 8:40 AM
    #20
    HotRodN

    HotRodN [OP] Active Member

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    Greg
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    Bumper, winch, fender flares. Stock ride height for now.
    Yea it is addicting LOL,,,, I've found another prospect up north,,,, it's a project Jeep,,, 71 frame with a YJ body,,, has the AMC 360 motor rebuilt but hasn't been started in over a year (scary),,, Dana 44 axles front and rear that are spring over,,, passenger side drop,,, 1 ton 3 speed trans and dual stick Atlas transfer case all rebuilt 0 miles,,, waiting on good photos of the whole deal to see what it actually looks like. Was thinking I'd swap the drive line into my 88 and put all the take off stuff on it and sell that off,,, maybe at the Conroe swap meet,,, yes sir,,, there are tons of options and routes to go with,,,, at least there are options :)
    One I'm still struggling with is weather to do the BIG V8 swap or do a beefed up 6 banger to save weight. That also plays into the rest of the drive line stuff,,,, it's good to not be in a hurry too,,, LOL.
     
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